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Post Posted: May 3, 2007 10:44 pm 
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Has your dog with the thyroid problem always been the alpha dog in the past?

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Post Posted: May 4, 2007 7:01 am 
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No, Stan has never been the alpha dog. Our older dog Ollie is and makes sure Stan knows it. Maybe that's part of the problem and Stan takes out his alpha tendencies on other dogs. I wish I knew.


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Post Posted: May 4, 2007 8:28 am 
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southpark wrote:
No, Stan has never been the alpha dog. Our older dog Ollie is and makes sure Stan knows it. Maybe that's part of the problem and Stan takes out his alpha tendencies on other dogs. I wish I knew.


Do you treat both dogs as equals?

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Post Posted: May 4, 2007 8:32 am 
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CMM-

We certainly try to do that. Stan attacks our older dog Ollie, too, but Ollie is able to defend himself and can get Stan to back down.


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Post Posted: May 4, 2007 8:43 am 
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southpark wrote:
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We certainly try to do that. Stan attacks our older dog Ollie, too, but Ollie is able to defend himself and can get Stan to back down.


This may be the problem. It may be that you are inadvertently causing confusion to the pack order. The pack hierarchy needs to be respected and could be that Stan is challenging Ollie for Alpha position because you treat them as equals. Since Ollie is the alpha dog you need to pet her first, let her go through the door first, feed her first, etc. Unfortunately you cannot treat your dogs equally in a multiple dog household.

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When it comes to eating, treats & petting, Ollie goes first, Stan goes second & Suzy goes third. The get equal amount of love and play time. What else is there to do? And now that being mean has been established, how can we trust him to not attack other dogs or people?


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southpark wrote:
When it comes to eating, treats & petting, Ollie goes first, Stan goes second & Suzy goes third. The get equal amount of love and play time. What else is there to do? And now that being mean has been established, how can we trust him to not attack other dogs or people?



You can't. especially since he's turned on you now.

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When my alpha dog (an epileptic Husky) has a seizure, my German Shepherd, who is normally very obedient to the Husky, senses his incapacitation, and moves right in aggressively to take over leadership.

He would never dare to do that under normal circumstances. And since I am always there, and I Am Alpha [censored word], he stays back. :) If I wasn't there, it would be a bloodbath.

Is Ollie getting older? slowing down? It's natural for a younger male to instinctively move into leadership. Him turning on you, however......

I think I would start with rechecking his thyroid levels, and looking for other possible medical problems. Some medications that work very well in 99.9% of all dogs, can have horrible effects on the 0.01% (just like with humans drugs).

And, of course, I would never leave them together unsupervised, ever again. My boys are best buds, but because of the occasional seizures, I would NEVER trust them alone together.

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Post Posted: May 4, 2007 11:59 am 
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southpark wrote:
When it comes to eating, treats & petting, Ollie goes first, Stan goes second & Suzy goes third. The get equal amount of love and play time. What else is there to do? And now that being mean has been established, how can we trust him to not attack other dogs or people?


When you correct him for bad behavior have you tried scruff shakes, stare downs and roll overs?

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Yup all that, though now that he's started turning on me, I don't get close enough for the scruff shakes. He used to respond to all that with my husband, but he's even challenging my husband now, too.

He's got this Jekyl and Hyde thing going on. You never know what he's going to do from one minute to the next. I'm hoping the vet will find something wrong tomorrow.


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Post Posted: May 4, 2007 2:00 pm 
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We had a springer spaniel that was like Stan. I was only 15ish when he was taken to the vet, so I don't rmember te meds they put him on. But, I was told it was "brain wave" medication. Something to calm the4 misfires in his brain...
It helped him a lot...

Good luck to you and Stan!

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ConiferMtMan wrote:
This may be the problem. It may be that you are inadvertently causing confusion to the pack order. The pack hierarchy needs to be respected and could be that Stan is challenging Ollie for Alpha position because you treat them as equals. Since Ollie is the alpha dog you need to pet her first, let her go through the door first, feed her first, etc. Unfortunately you cannot treat your dogs equally in a multiple dog household.


That may be true for your dogs but our experience is quite different. We have two equal size dogs, a lab mix and a retriever. The female lab is was and will always be alpha dog, the male knows this and there has never been a problem between the two. The retriever tends to get more attention because he craves it more, he also gets his food first. He will however back off from the water dish if he sees that the lab wants a drink.
We try to treat them equally and what we do or don't do seems to have no difference in their own pecking order. They both know that the real alpha dog is us.

Now that the lab is ailing from both acute arthritis and heart difficulties I was afraid that the younger retriever would take advantage, but that has not happened. The only time I have seen him pull a power play was when we had my daughter's cattle dog here for a week and he made it very clear on day one that she was at the bottom of the pecking order.


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